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| Zpoxy as a finish? http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=44432 |
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| Author: | warpedbored [ Tue Oct 28, 2014 1:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Zpoxy as a finish? |
I find lots of posts on using Zpoxy as a grain filler. I used it myself with good results on my last build. Before I sanded it back and sprayed nitro I noticed it had a high gloss with lots of depth. Has anyone used it as a finish? I don't have a warm dry place to spray. I usually do it outside. Rainy wet November in western Oregon won't work very well. I suppose French polish would be an option but the truth is I suck at it. Thanks in advance. |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Tue Oct 28, 2014 4:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
I've seen this question before and a very experience professional, no longer on the forum, told us it's too soft to buff out. |
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| Author: | Michael.N. [ Tue Oct 28, 2014 4:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
You don't have to to all the twirling and whirling when French Polishing. Straight lines done with the pad is perfectly acceptable and don't let anyone fool you into thinking that you can't get a so called professional finish after using that technique. It's just a matter of doing enough straight lines, often enough to obtain a suitable body of finish. It's the technique that French Polishers used for something like table legs, where the surface area didn't really warrant the more complicated technique. In fact I think French Polishing is one of the easiest finishes to learn or rather it's incredibly easy to recover from mistakes, so one would have to seriously mess things up to have to start right back at the beginning. |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
David Wren learned the straight line technique via the de Jonges I believe, and it works fine (good great) and looks like a lot less wear and tear on the body... |
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| Author: | Greg B [ Tue Oct 28, 2014 1:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
FWIW. There are epoxy clear top coat finishes available that are targeted at model makers. "Klass Kote" is one. I have no idea how or if they would work for musical instruments, and AFAIK no one has tried. I'd be concerned with excessive damping, but it might be fine. Not sure if it will rub out or not. Zpoxy itself is re-purposed model maker's filler. A quality oil varnish is always a good choice. It makes a finish which is much tougher than shellac, and for that matter tougher than nitro, with better depth than either. I always used the old (phenolic) Behlen's Rockhard varnish, but it's gone, and I'm not sure what's good now. |
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| Author: | Michael.N. [ Wed Oct 29, 2014 5:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
meddlingfool wrote: David Wren learned the straight line technique via the de Jonges I believe, and it works fine (good great) and looks like a lot less wear and tear on the body... It can be a real time saver. Even more so if you accept open pores! Otherwise your pore filling has to be done to a high standard and sanding to a high grit helps to cut down on the time needed for applying the shellac. I don't really go for the high gloss but instead I let the lines from the cloth diffuse the light. If it's done carefully you can get a perfectly acceptable semi gloss like surface that appears quite deliberate. Virtually no sanding is done on the Shellac. Pointless removing what you have just put on! If you really insist on the super flat, super gloss you will have to put more shellac on in order to have enough there to make for a very flat and very level surface. I guess that's where the circle technique is superior, in that it helps to fill in all the little dips and tiny voids. It takes me near 10 hours work to pore fill and french Polish a Guitar using the more usual technique. Less than half that time if I use a brush or use the straight line technique. Kind of makes perfect sense to me, especially considering that I prefer the less glossy finish. Shellac itself is pretty hard and tough. You only have to try scratching a button lac to discover just how hard it is. The reason why it wears through relatively quickly is because of just how thinnly it is applied, that and some folks alkaline sweat causes it to wear. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sat Nov 01, 2014 8:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
I haven't used Zpoxy, but I think West System epoxy will give you a hard enough finish to sand and buff to a high polish. I would still be inclined to F.P. the soundboard. |
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| Author: | A.Hix [ Sat Nov 01, 2014 3:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
Greg B wrote: FWIW. There are epoxy clear top coat finishes available that are targeted at model makers. "Klass Kote" is one. I have no idea how or if they would work for musical instruments, and AFAIK no one has tried. I'd be concerned with excessive damping, but it might be fine. Not sure if it will rub out or not. Zpoxy itself is re-purposed model maker's filler. A quality oil varnish is always a good choice. It makes a finish which is much tougher than shellac, and for that matter tougher than nitro, with better depth than either. I always used the old (phenolic) Behlen's Rockhard varnish, but it's gone, and I'm not sure what's good now. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Guitar-Luthier- ... 1044711893 This is the BEST oil varnish around. Try it out. |
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| Author: | Trevor Gore [ Sat Nov 01, 2014 7:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
Clay S. wrote: I haven't used Zpoxy, but I think West System epoxy will give you a hard enough finish to sand and buff to a high polish. I would still be inclined to F.P. the soundboard. Hard enough for sure, but it doesn't polish like NC or FP. Buff through and you find that out  .
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| Author: | ernie [ Sun Nov 02, 2014 10:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Zpoxy as a finish? |
System 3 epoxy with silica thinned with alcohol seems to work for our headstocks , but I was use 360 grit and shellac sealer , before finishing.. I prefer behlens oil based or water based filler for neck/backs /sides. |
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